Markus Lanz tears the patience of the Russia expert – "You defend Putin"

TV talk with Markus Lanz (ZDF) on the escalation in the Ukraine conflict and possible western reactions to the invasion of Russian troops in Ukraine.

Berlin – The day after Vladimir Putin’s speech, in which he legitimized the recognition of the two border regions of Donetsk and Luhansk between Ukraine and Russia as autonomous regions and thus legitimized military measures against Ukraine, there was dismay on the political stage. Markus Lanz shared this with his guests in his program on February 22, 2022 on ZDF. He tried to get a clearer picture of the extent of the conflict, Putin’s motivation and possible future developments from the experts present.

But Markus Lanz could hardly hide his already established position on Vladimir Putin, whom he considers a liar and megalomaniac. That’s why he clashed in the course of the show with the author and former ARD Moscow correspondent Gabriele Krone-Schmalz. “You’re defending Putin,” he finally told her towards the end of the discussion on ZDF. And admittedly, Krone-Schmalz repeatedly pleaded for more understanding of Putin’s position.

Markus Lanz (ZDF) clashes with a Russia expert

While she was surprised that he was so specific and inconciliatory in that speech, one has to understand that this is just an expression of his mood. “Putin is hurt, he doesn’t feel taken seriously,” she said. The whole of Russian society is like that. There is a “deep disappointment” that they, the Russians, are being portrayed as liars, she added.

Ukraine conflict with Markus Lanz (ZDF): Krone-Schmalz recommends a change of perspective when dealing with Putin

While she called for “not to philosophize unnecessarily about what Putin might mean in his speech and how exactly” a change of perspective is urgently needed in order to “keep the peace”. No matter how correct the second part of this statement is, Krone-Schmalz tried to evade the actual discussion with Markus Lanz on ZDF with the first part. Rather, the moderator wanted to know what concrete consequences could be derived from Putin’s speech.

For political scientist Gwendolyn Sasse, it was clear that Putin had openly withdrawn Ukraine’s right to exist. He argues that Lenin made the mistake of granting Ukraine too much autonomy as early as 1917. This shows how Putin wants to historically legitimize his actions, she said.

Markus Lanz (ZDF) was much more on the same wavelength with Sasse that evening. And not just with her. The journalist and deputy editor-in-chief of Die Welt, Robin Alexander, was just as emotionally agitated as Lanz himself. For Putin, “there are no longer any borders,” he said. On this basis, “Germany could also decide tomorrow to take Austria on board,” he proclaimed polemically. “Anyone who isn’t completely stupid wants peace with Russia, but how can that be if he wipes everything away,” he added desperately. He alluded to the efforts of the last and current federal government, which tried to take Putin’s arguments seriously but were rewarded with lies.

SPD General Secretary Kevin Kühnert is also certain that Putin’s behavior is a political demonstration of power. “But we can’t choose who sits at the other end of the negotiating table,” he admitted on ZDF. He only thinks to a limited extent about “confidence-building measures”, as demanded by Krone-Schmalz, rather he believes that the decision against the commissioning of the Nord Stream 2 pipeline is entirely correct.

This may also have consequences for the German population, because “a sanction that only disadvantages one side” does not exist. Krone-Schmalz contradicted him insofar as she thinks there are double standards. “Why doesn’t the USA stop its oil imports?” she interjected, not without justification, “Germany is only harming itself.”

Markus Lanz (ZDF): SPD general secretary avoids the question of gas prices

So far, there are still 30 percent of gas reserves from deliveries that have already been made, and they would get Germany through this heating period, replied Kühnert. Kühnert reacted in a distracting manner to Lanz’s fear that this would increase energy prices in Germany. You can now feel the indecisiveness of not having invested in renewable energies earlier. “The need for the energy transition has become all the more visible,” he said on ZDF.

In the end, Kühnert came under fire again from both Markus Lanz and Robin Alexander, who wanted to prove that he, or rather his party, the SPD, had a conflict of interest because Gerhard Schröder is closely linked to Gazprom, the operator of the Nord Stream pipelines is.

Alexander pointed out the inconsistencies of the Foundation for Climate and Environmental Protection in Mecklenburg-Western Pomerania, which Schröder is supposed to be responsible for together with Prime Minister Manuela Schleswig. He also ventured the thesis that Putin, like in France and Italy, is now buying politicians in Germany who could be of use to him. Here the arguments overturned, those present were not really convinced of Kühnert’s assurances of the independence of the SPD in this matter.

Unfortunately, by this time it had almost been forgotten what a serious situation the Ukrainian population is currently in. Gwendolyn Sasse and Gabriele Krone-Schmalz had described how drastic the situation must be, since crossing the contact lines was practically impossible and this would lead to supply problems.

Even before the start of the program on Markus-Lanz-ZDF, Kevin Kühnert had vowed to take the local people seriously in their desire for a democratic government. It is extremely remarkable that “the vast majority of Ukrainians are committed to us, they long to belong to the EU”, while the EU states themselves sometimes hesitate to show their loyalty. That is why Ukraine is “a delicate plant that we should treat very responsibly.” (Teresa Vena)